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Post by mickmack on Feb 26, 2007 22:00:34 GMT
Should there be a rule that if a divisional team wins 3 county championships in a row, it (South Kerry for example) would not be allowed into the county championship for say 2 years.
South Kerry could win 7,8 or 10 championships in a row and its tough on the likes of Crokes who may well be crowned the best club side on 17th March. Gooch may never captain Kerry. Is that fair? As a north Kerry man I have no axe to grind on this issue or that fair play. South Kerry have been great champions but it draws from 10 clubs.
Crossmaglen have won 10 championships in Armagh so its not impossible that South Kerry win do the same.
How about it?
Before disagreeing......... think what is best for Kerry
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Post by kerrycrusher on Feb 26, 2007 23:09:21 GMT
Well East kerry won 3 in a row a few years ago. Im sure the same points were raised.
Its funny, nobody mentioned anything when Sth Kerry hadnt won anything for 20 odd years
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 27, 2007 0:20:57 GMT
like all teams south kerry will come and go.its also more proberly likely that south kerry wont win 11 championships in as row.Already their manager has resigned and their midfielder is training the kerry team,he will hardly be able to give as much time next year.
theres only one kerry senior from south kerry,its not like they 8 or 9 of them.
in the last census south kerry came in with 5500 people a tiny population for a vast area of land.On any given time i'd say there is at least 1500 of that 5500 people away,either working or in college. Tralee has a population of over 20000,killarney 10000 people,further a field clubs like kilmacud crokes has a catchment area of 30000,navan 15000,leixlip 20000,lucan over 30000. for such a tiny population i think we should be complimenting the great work thats been done down there.Poeple like jack o connor has given massive service to south kerry underage football in the school winning 3 munsters in a row.Thats where the winning is.Let the other areas in kerry emulate this great work at underage and beat them on the field not in the board room.Theres lads driving down from dublin,limerick and cork midweek to train with the team,while also averaging up to 30 weekends a year traveling up and down.Thats comitment. South kery have won 5 or 6 championships in over a 100 years,hardly a hanging offense. i spend a lot of time in south kerry,once the tourists leave the ring of kerry in the autumn all thats missing in places like,kells,caherciveen,renard,valentia,waterville,dromid and sneem is the tumble weed rolling down the road in howling wind. let the people of south kerry enjoy their hard earned success and their identity as three time senior kerry champions in a row coming from a small population of proud people. i'm sure the gooch will gain massive personal fullfilment if the crokes win the all-ireland,personally i'm delighted that maurice fitzgerald has won 3 senior championship medals,his displays have been heart warming in the last three novembers.Everything is relative and everything pans out in time,no need to be getting excited over it.
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Post by watchdahop on Feb 27, 2007 8:59:54 GMT
Can't see anyone preventing South Kerry playing in the championship. Why should they? Its up to other teams to get up to their level. I can't see them winning 10 or 11 in a row either: football is too strong all over Kerry for that to happen. Normally you would expect some to the clubs in the division to be challenging to go on their own. The other thing that might happen is some of the clubs might want to go on a run in the junior or intermediate all ireland.
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Post by seamus on Feb 27, 2007 9:38:04 GMT
That is the one surprising thing with South Kerry. For an area with a number of clubs that have performed well in recent years it is amazing that none have goen senior. Having said that i think i am right in saying that when Mary's were going well they actually won the intermediate and were not allowed to go senior as the new rules were not in place. Dromid should really have won an intermediate as well in recent years.
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Post by owenabue on Feb 27, 2007 9:58:58 GMT
Is the South Kerry thing the same as the divisions in Cork? I know plenty of people have given out in Cork about the county champions picking the captain. If a player is only there cos the division/club nominated him as captain, it can cause problems. But generally I would say the players would have been there or there abouts anyway. I know people have debated about the likes of UCC in our championship as well. But if it makes the championship more competitive, surely that's a good thing?
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Post by mickmack on Feb 27, 2007 11:04:43 GMT
When ye were replying, did ye think about whats best for Kerry or just South Kerry.
Take a helicopter view as the americans say. In the last couple of years have South Kerry won nearly everything at minor and under 21? I am not sure but I think they have. Most of the South Kerry players have worn the green and gold at some point. How many other teams in the championship can say that?
Think of it this way............
Ardfert have come from Division 5 to winning Kerry and all Ireland Junior titles. They then go intermediate and win the county title and are now in the all ireland final.
If they play serior championship next year they could draw South Kerry. Ardfert have just one person who wore the Kerry jersey.......stephen wallace as a junior. Ardfert has a population of 500 approx and is also one of the top ckubs in hurling too........ with a lot of dual players.
My proposal would gives club teams a shot at the title for 2 years before South Kerry come back into it again.
Again ........... think what is best for Kerry football overall
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Post by owenabue on Feb 27, 2007 12:01:28 GMT
Not sure exclusion would help Kerry football. If players are from Junior clubs they need all the practice they can get at senior level. As for the 500 people, Newtownshandrum in Cork would be the same and they managed to win an All Ireland.
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Post by watchdahop on Feb 27, 2007 12:03:40 GMT
The idea of divisional teams is that everyone gets a chance to play in the county championship. If a players club is not good enough then that player can play with their divisional team and still play for the title. You can't exclude divisional teams: if (and it will never happen) South Kerry were excluded you wouldn't have the best players in the county playing.
So under your proposal no South Kerry player would play in the senior championship for 2 years? Where's the logic in that?
Put it another way who would want to win a county if they best players weren't playing in it. You can't call yourself the best if you can't beat the best.
A club only championship would not have the best players in the county playing.
There are many examples of players winning countys even though they came from small clubs.
By your logic after removing all the strong divisions wouldn't you then feel compelled to start removing the strong clubs? Would you keep removing them till a team like Ardfert wins? Would it be the senior championship but only for clubs drawing from a population of less than 500 and who only have one player who played Junior for Kerry who are also a dual club who play in black and white who used to play in Division 5?
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Post by seamus on Feb 27, 2007 12:37:07 GMT
The divisional championship is one of the main reasons why Kerry are the kings of football. Most other counties only have players from senior clubs on their teams as junior/intermediate players never get exposed to the intensity of senior football and the jump to inter county is too big to close. I think Cork and kerry are the only counties to have divisional teams??
Of the current panel: Galvin Fitzmaurice sean Sullivan Declan Sullivan Brian Sheehan Ronan Hussey Reidy Young Darren Sullivan Seamus Scanlon Paul OConnor all play with junior or intermediate clubs. The divisional set up allows these players to be judged by selectors against the best players in the county in the county championship. If you cant do it at that level you cant play inter county. There is a big jump from being a good minor or u21 to starring at county championship level.
South Kerry have raised the bar and the standard of football in the county just as East Kerry did. It is up to all other teams to respond which has to be good for the county teams.
Don't forget South Kerry have their own problems. 9 clubs who all feel they should have a strong representation on the team, with very little to choose between a number of players. Politics is a massive problem and with a new trainer they may struggle this year.
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 27, 2007 12:58:08 GMT
i fully agree with watchdahop the seamus on this one.
how would not allowing ronan hussey,declan,bryan and killian not play senior championship for two years be better for kerry.
micky harte won a league with tyrone in the early '00s but said it was hollow because some of the best teams were not playing in it,especially kerry who were div.2 that spring. non of south kerry clubs that made it to div.1 in the co.league survived there,most are struggling at the bottom of div.2.the majority of south kerry clubs are div 3,4 standard with one or two comfortable in div2. These small areas dont have there plays living and working at home,most have to leave,maybe ardfert being a suburb of the more urban tralee area can keep their players at home.
take a look around mickmack,kerry are ultra competive at every level in the country,why fix something thats not broken,would kerry not be competive at minor,u21 and junior level if their was no spirt or players coming out of south kerry.
if every other district worked as hard as south kerry it would bring betterment in general.
A question for you,would ardfert be beter off playing with district area next year in the senior championship for the betterment of the district or is their solo run something off an ego trip for the lads?
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Post by mickmack on Feb 27, 2007 13:14:03 GMT
My proposal would seldom be used. East kerry won 3 and no more. AllI right is saying that south kerry have cleaned up at under age level in recent years? Do we want a situation where the county championship becomes a procession.............
Under my proposal....... for the two years that this would apply the south kerry players would play for their clubs in whatever championship they are in. In year 3 they can regoup and pick up 3 more county titles in a row. Meanwhile Crokes or An Gaeltacht might win the championship and Gooch ot Tomas o shea gets a shot at the captaincy.
Ardfert want to give it a go next year and more luck to them......
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 27, 2007 14:07:27 GMT
ya and it would take south kerry another 20 years to regroup,get everyone pulling to-gether and sort out the politics of 9 clubs.
you will find that south kerrys run will end sooner rather than latter,lads cant keep driving from dublin,limerick and cork midweek for ever,that the reality of life in isolated areas of south west ireland.
enjoy what they have achieved and compliment them for it.
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Post by mickmack on Feb 27, 2007 14:18:00 GMT
Time will tell.... ................. Would u think it a bad thing if they won 10 in a row?
Who won the minor and under 21 in 2004, 2005 and 2006? I dont know the answer to this but it will be a good indicator for the future. South Kerry are fine champions and its great that Maurice Fitz got his reward
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 27, 2007 14:59:28 GMT
ya i agree it would not be great if south kerry won 10 in a row,i'd imagine theres not a lot of hope amongst the other clubs in armagh.Baltinglass won 7 or 8 in a row in wicklow,it cant be a good thing in a county.
maurice is proberly finished after last co.final,the manager has resigned and john sugrue their trainer and midfielder is gone with kerry.Thats three major driving points of focus gone from last year.
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